Sofia Blasco On Making The Art Of Dance Accessible

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Jillian Curwin: Hi everyone. Welcome to Always Looking Up, the podcast where no one is overlooked and height is only a number, never a limit. Hosted by me, Jillian Curwin. Each week I'll be having a conversation about what it is like to live in a world that is not necessarily designed for you. 

In this week’s episode I sat down with Sofia Blasco. Sofia is a dancer, Pure Barre instructor, and co-founder and executive director of The Dancer Movement, an organization that is dedicated to reimagining the experience of dance for people with disabilities. We discuss the origins of The Dancer Movement and developing a teaching style for students with disabilities, the importance of collaboration when making a space accessible, and how and why disability can and should be brought into the fitness and dance worlds.

Let's get into it. Hi, Sofia.

Sofia Blasco: Hi Jillian. How are you?

Jillian Curwin: I'm good. How are you?

Sofia Blasco: Good. Thanks for having me.

Jillian Curwin: Thank you so much for coming on. I'm very excited to be talking with you today.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah, you as well. I'm so excited.

Jillian Curwin: To start, why don't you tell my listeners a little bit about yourself?

Sofia Blasco: Sure. So, as you said, my name is Sofia. I'm a dancer, I'm a certified Pure Barre instructor in New York City, and I own a company called The Dancer Movement, and we provide dance classes for people with disabilities.

Jillian Curwin: Which I love as a former dancer, as someone into fitness, as a disabled person. I love all of that. And before we get into it, I am curious to ask, would you consider yourself to be an ally to the disabled community? And if so, how would you define being an ally?

Sofia Blasco: Absolutely. Yes. So I do consider myself an ally. I am not disabled myself. So definitely an ally of the disability community. And I always like to tell people I really define that as just being able to listen to those who are disabled and taking action from there. But listening is always first.

Jillian Curwin: Cannot agree more with that. I think that is so key. I think that's something that’s sometimes lacking is that people who say they're allies, but they won't listen to what the disabled community is saying to them. And it's frustrating for the community, for the movement to have people who say they're listening but really aren't. And then, again, it emphasizes why it is so important to have people like you, who really are listening to the community and also including the community in, in your allyship, in doing the work and making sure that you're, you know, taking everything into consideration, and trying to do… Obviously, disability is incredibly diverse and what I need is different from someone in a wheelchair needs versus with someone with an invisible disability needs. But you're listening to all these voices and then doing your part to really make sure that they're being heard, which I think is so incredibly important.

Sofia Blasco: Absolutely. Yeah. It's… I've learned so much jumping into this. And I always say to people, like, just in the last year of starting this business, I've learned so much. I wasn't, I wasn't as aware of most of this stuff until I really dove into the community, and, yeah, just continuing to learn and know that you're always continuing to learn.

Jillian Curwin: What was the starting point? Like, why did you want to start the Dancer Movement? Why did you want to get into this adaptive fitness space?

Sofia Blasco: Yeah, so I, I was in college as a dance major, like pre-COVID. Only wanted to dance, only wanted to perform, didn't want to teach, I just wanted to be on the stage somewhere.

Jillian Curwin: Yeah!

Sofia Blasco: And I graduated in January of 2020. So, like, I had a month and a half of, like, real post-college life and then COVID hit. And so I was kind of scrambling as pretty much the rest of the world was. And I have a really good friend who, she's a mother, she's an author, she has a children's book, and she has multiple sclerosis. And she used to be a tap dancer, she used to take tap as a kid, she did it up through high school. And I was talking to her and I was like, “Let's go take an open class together,” like as every dancer in New York City does, you know, like, “Okay, when’re we dancing together?” And she was like, “Well, no, like, I can't like I, you know, ever since I was diagnosed with MS, I stopped dancing, I don't feel like I can walk into a dance studio in New York City and just try to take a tap class.” And I was not aware of that. I was like, I was like, “Oh, oh my gosh. Okay. Yeah, I guess, that's a great point. I didn't think of that.” And so I really just started by Googling just for the two of us. I was like, okay, well, I'll find this space. I'm sure it exists. It's New York City. This is the dance world like…and it didn't. And she was like, “Well, can't you teach me a tap class?” And I was like, “Oh, I could, yeah, I know how to do that.” And from there it just kind of kept going. And like, the more I got into it, the more I realized it didn't exist. And I just kind of knew it was like, well, I guess that means I'm going to make it exist.

Jillian Curwin: I love that. I love that you were just like, I'm going to do this. I'm going to create this thing that doesn't exist. And, as someone who’s been into fitness for quite some time and has been a dancer since on and off, since I was like three years old, you know, I never really considered the fact that there isn't really adaptive fitness. And it is so important as someone who has to constantly try to adapt her surroundings and had to stop dance because of my body and because of the studio and because of just everything going on at the time. And but, like, I know the passion was still there.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: The want to move was still there. That never went away. That still is in me. And I'm sure it's in a lot of people and we, all disabled people, regardless of how we move, we do move, and we do want to move, and we do want to get around and be able to move our bodies and express our bodies, especially for dancers, where dance is such… just an expression of how we're feeling. So for you to take that and say, okay, this class doesn't exist, but I still want to dance with you, so I'm going to create this class. And then where it led to is incredible.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah, it's been a, it's been a crazy journey and just… yeah. For me as a dancer, you know, someone who's not disabled coming at it from that angle, I just couldn't fathom, like, why it didn't exist.

Jillian Curwin: Mmhmm.

Sofia Blasco: Like, it's not, it's not that hard. It's like, if I can do it… I was just a dance major in college, you know what I mean? Like, I have the experience, obviously, but it was like, why am I the only one? And I'm sure I'm not. But like, why has nobody else tried to do this before?

Jillian Curwin: Well, why do you think that is? So I'm curious to hear your answer to that question.

Sofia Blasco: I… Ooh, no one's ever actually asked it back before. Umm, I think that dance is so specific and like as a dance major in college and just growing up in it, we talk about this endlessly. Dancers are constantly having this conversation that, you know, dance is a very old art form, and it comes from a lot of history and that's a very not inclusive history like in all terms - in terms of race, in terms of gender - like dance is not very inclusive. It comes from, you know, classical ballet, which is the male prince and the female princess. And if you're, you know, you can't be black on stage because the rest of the dancers are white. Like, there's a lot of things that we're constantly talking about. And I just feel like dance is still so far behind and trying to get past all that, that disability somehow just fell at the bottom of the list. And it's like, I feel like we just haven't even gotten there yet. Like, we're still like mind blown that Misty Copeland was like, you know, a black dancer on stage and it's like, oh, my gosh. Like, if that's where the dance world is, like, we're, we still feel like we're very far behind and we've come a long way. But I just feel like, not that the dance world doesn't care, but it's just like, oh my gosh, like, we haven't even gotten there yet.

Jillian Curwin: Right. And I think the dance world kind of reflects the world in general, in the sense of like with DE and I efforts going on, disability is often left out or kind of like, forgotten. But it's so interesting that you talk about with Misty Copeland, because I remember when she got her promotion to principal and what… being such a big deal and I kind of was out of the dance world at that point, but it took a second, like, oh, this is it. Like it's 20…. Like it was late… 2000? Like 2010s, that she got promoted and she was the first like… So it's...So like, again, like it just was like, you know, the dance world is still catching up to where we are. And, you know, I think another reason why disability, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, is that because it is so focused on the body and what it can do and dancers, especially ballet dancers, when you think of - I think when society thinks of dance, they automatically go to ballet - they're these light, flexible bodies that disability just doesn't fall into.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah, no. And that's like, I would think the number one reason is because it's a, it's a visual art form based on your body and like, you know, a painter gets to paint a picture and that's the art that they're showing, like they always used to tell us when we were kids, your body is your instrument. Your body is the final piece that you're showing off. And so it adds this whole layer, especially for something that's so visual, but it's, it's just a matter, and not to simplify it because it's not simple, it's complicated, it's just a matter of people in the dance world and kind of just changing the definition of who can be a dancer. It's okay, fine. It's my body, but my body is my body regardless.

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: So like, why? Why is it different?

Jillian Curwin: Exactly. And I think, and this might be controversial in the dance world to say, like, every body can dance, it just may not be the way that we expect it to dance or the way that we've been taught to dance. But every body is capable of movement, of dancing, and that should be embraced in the dance world, especially because it is such an expression…

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: Of how we're feeling in that moment.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah. Yeah. And I always say, like, when I teach my classes, like, you won't look like me and I won't look like you and you won't look like the person next to you, but isn't that the point of art? Like, if I told you to draw the sun and I drew the sun, it wouldn't look like the same sun because it's art. That's the point Which is like…

Jillian Curwin: Exactly.

Sofia Blasco: It's… That's why, to me, it's so easy to make dance accessible. [background noise] There's, like, a wild thing going on outside my window.

But it's easy for me to make dance accessible because it's an art form. There's no wrong answer. Again and, you know, I grew up doing classical ballet, so I also appreciate that, like, you know, in very classical forms there is a wrong answer.

Jillian Curwin: Yes.

Sofia Blasco: Like some dancers are more technical, great. They're the ones that will be professional ballerinas on stage. That's fine. That doesn't mean we have to close the doors to everybody in the dance world completely.

Jillian Curwin: Exactly. Like when I was younger dancing, I knew I wasn't going to be a…,even company, just at my local dance studio, dancer for reasons mainly because of my body, but for other reasons that I won't go into. But, I still wanted to be able to dance and I still love dancing and being on stage. And I think that should be, you know, what's continuing…Like there shouldn't be a stopping point. When you're younger that's always encouraged, just like to be able to just dance, like I'm saying, younger is like a kid.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: And I don't think that we should have a stopping point for dance. I think that there is obviously realities of, again, being disabled means that there are things we can't do. I can't be a prima ballerina.

Sofia Blasco: You can. You should.

Jillian Curwin: [Laughter] I like…It’s really like…it’s, it's hard and I'm not taking that away. It is incredibly hard. And it, they have to also make it look incredibly easy, too…

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: Which makes… compounds the difficulty. But I think that, you know, I wish I wasn't discouraged to stop dancing…

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: Before I was ready to.

Sofia Blasco: Right. Yeah. I mean, that's like I use myself as an example all the time. I did classical ballet my whole life. I went to a school in Bethlehem where we did a Nutcracker every year, and a spring ballet every year, and I was all ballet all the time. But I also knew because of my own body type and B, just because of my technique, I wasn't ever going to be a professional ballerina. Maybe a professional dancer, but like…

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: And that's fine. But I still did ballet up until like, up until now. I still go take ballet classes because I love ballet the most.

Jillian Curwin: Mmmhmm.

Sofia Blasco: So, like, yeah, there's, there's that level for everyone as in ever… anything. Not everyone's going to be a professional, you know, whatever it is. You have to have the skills and the technique. But, if it's something you enjoy, there's no reason you should have to stop doing it.

Jillian Curwin: Exactly. So then I'm curious. So your friend comes to you, asks you to teach a class and that sparks something. So then how did you develop your teaching method? How did you learn to adapt the moves? Because again, for some dances like ballet, and even like tap, it is very technical and very precise.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah, absolutely. I just kind of, you know, we were coming up with a business plan like, okay, how is this going to work? And I actually started by breaking down, and this is the way our classes are written on our website still, because we didn't know who would be joining them. I kind of had them broken down, one really by disability, not by disability type, but like, you know, if your, if you can use your upper body for this dance class, you'll be in this class. If you need visual help, you'll be in this class. I kind of broke it down, but not too specifically. And then I just took whatever dance style I thought made the most sense in that realm.

Jillian Curwin: Mmmhmm.

Sofia Blasco: So like, our classical modern class, I chose, you know, that would be a class for wheelchair users because I find that when I do classical modern, I mostly use like the expression in my torso, in my arms. And again, it's different for every wheelchair user. These are very generic and we don't really use those anymore because now it's open to anybody for any class. But mentally, that's kind of how I broke down the techniques.

And then when I teach class, I just try to give as many variations as possible. And again, I use my own experience as a dancer. So, I try to give like, what the move is, where it comes from, if you've never taken a dance class, what it might look like, what you've seen - a picture of a ballerina doing it, and then, ummm, an imagery of how it feels in my body so that you can take that image and put it in any part of your body. So if I'm doing a bend in my legs and it feels like they're being stretched apart like taffy, you're taking the vision of being stretched apart, like taffy and bending. And you could do that in your neck, or your eyeballs, or your wrists.

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: And so I kind of use that basis. So it really, I actually find it easier in dance forms that are very technical, because you have, like, these guidelines of what it is and what it feels like, and then you can kind of just take it and do what you want with it.

Jillian Curwin: That is so interesting and not what I had expect that like, the more technical, because again, like growing up, like I remember like my toes had to be at a certain height and my knee for it to be a correct like, passé, which is basically you're bending your leg and having your toes touch your knees. And I was, at one point, like, my leg does not do that.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: Like I… and so like, I was just like, it's, I don't have enough leg to be able to do that. And so I was… That was not the answer I was expecting that, like, the technical moves would be the easier ones to adapt. And I love that.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah, I just, it's kind of, I, I didn't expect it either at all. Like, you think like, oh my gosh, this should be like an improv like, freestyle dance class, which those are fun too, and they're obviously very easy to adapt for everyone. And it might just be because I was trained on classical dance, so that's what I know best, which means I feel like I can explain it best. But yeah, I do find like that, that strictness, that, that shape that you're trying to make, like… For example, a passé, which is when you said, when you're bending your leg up and it's meant to be like a triangle that your leg makes with your knee and toe.

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: But when I do a passé in my classes, I demonstrate it with my arm, and it's the same exact shape. But now I have an image, because I know what a passé looks like…

Jillian Curwin: Mmmhmm.

Sofia Blasco: I can do it in my arm. So, like, that's… it might just be how my brain works, but I do find that that classical technique is very helpful.

Jillian Curwin: Thank g-d your brain works like that because I feel like you're not just ahead of the dance industry, or dance world, and making it adaptable, but you're ahead of the fitness industry as a whole because, you know, I walk into a gym, I don't see other disabled people there.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: I work with a trainer and they figure out how to work with me. But I've asked them like, “Do you, are you taught how to work with people with disabilities?” And they're like, “No.”

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: Like, it’s not in that education. And so you're ahead of the game.

Sofia Blasco: It's…and that's what's so crazy to me…

Jillian Curwin: Mmmhmm.

Sofia Blasco: Is that I feel like I shouldn't be ahead of the game. All I did was take a passé and put it on my arm, you know what I mean?

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco:  It's like…It's just crazy. And I know it's, it’s harder than it seems, but it's, it feels like it shouldn't be. It doesn't have to be.

Jillian Curwin: It shouldn’t be. And again, because it goes back to the simple idea that everybody moves, and that disabled people, I think, and it kind of, maybe goes into the fact that there's a stereotype of disability being unhealthy.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: And so, which is not the case at all, and so they don't belong in spaces like a dance studio or like a gym, so we're not going to market to them work and we’re not going to take the time to learn how to train them. And this is just me speaking. And if someone in the industry is like, she is wrong, please come on and tell me that, because, like, I want to… I would, I want to be proven wrong. But this is just based on my experience, you know, like, I see the marketing and there's like a couple of companies off the top of my head that, you know, that are making strides to be more accessible and more inclusive for the disabled community, but a lot of them aren't, and aren't having disabled people in the rooms when making marketing decisions. And I don't know with, like, the development of the training curriculum, but I don't know if disabled people are being brought in the room…

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: But like again, my trainer didn't know how like…he had to figure it out with me.

Sofia Blasco: That’s so interesting that that's, like, a story you have because the woman I started this because of, the one with MS, told me she, like, when she was first diagnosed, was also trying to like, stay in fitness. And it's important to keep moving with a diagnosis like that. It's good for you. And she got a trainer as well in a gym, and said to him ahead of time like, “Hey, I have MS,” which is a very complex thing. And if you're not somebody that's lived through it, like, it's so different for every person. So there's a complexity to that. But she came in and like, he was asking her to basically just do things that like, he was like, if you Googled it beforehand…

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: You would know, like you're asking me to jump rope and like, overheating is going to affect my symptoms. So like, they, that person didn't even sound like they were taking the time to make the effort, but yeah, no idea. And he, they had a warning and they still, like, couldn't even adapt to, to that.

Jillian Curwin: Right, which I'm honestly not surprised at because I think that there's just like this kind of like, assumption that, again, like, it'll work for everybody. Where fitness, we know itself or just nondisabled people, it's not one size fits all.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: Like so to try to force just the type of, you know, the curriculum or the education, like on to someone who, with a disability like it's not going to work.

Sofia Blasco: Mmmhmmm.

Jillian Curwin: And, you know, I love the trainer that I worked with because he said, okay, we're going to figure this out. It's not… might not work the first time. Let's try. And I'm the kind of person who will try anything, and probably does things in the gym that…

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: No sane person should. But like, I just like, I'm like, let's try. Like, let's see what works and what doesn't because then I can, you know, through my platforms and through talking to other people who may be with different disabilities, or with dwarfism, who may not feel that the gym is somewhere that they can work out, or may not know what to do and say, well, I tried this and this works for me.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: Maybe it'll work for you, you know, and I didn't think this is going to work. So I think that is so important to have, even if the education isn't there, you know, when they're taking the certification, to not stop learning and to work with people and figure this out, because then maybe it will be part of the curriculum.

Sofia Blasco: Right. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's crazy to me. And you actually had brought this to my attention in the fitness side because I am doing, as you know, adaptive fitness classes through Pure Barre.

Jillian Curwin: Mmmhmm.

Sofia Blasco: Which was kind of a combination of them knowing this is what I did and it was a whole thing. But, when I was talking to you and you were saying that in personal fitness, when they're training to be a personal fitness trainer, it's, there's no, like, section on that.

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: Which, again, it’s not that I didn’t think about it. I think I just maybe assumed that would be part of the training. And it blew my mind that that was not.

Jillian Curwin: So did I. I thought it would be part of it because disabled people, you know…I didn't know what I was doing when I started at the gym.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: And like disabled people, again, needing also to find ways to work out that they're, you know, to protect their bodies, but also to be able to move their bodies effectively is so important. So I would think that that would just be a part of it and it's not. And it's also, it's also, like, shocking and it's not at the same time.

Sofia Blasco: Right. It's…it, it blows my mind.

Jillian Curwin: Mmmhmm. So you did talk about Pure Barre. So I'm won… just kind of like where I wanted to go to next is like, how…? So, you’re…you became a Pure Barre instructor?

Sofia Blasco: Yes.

Jillian Curwin: And then they were just, became aware? Did you tell them? Like, how did then you start doing these adaptive classes through Pure Barre?

Sofia Blasco: Yeah. So I had my company first…

Jillian Curwin: Okay.

Sofia Blasco: The Dancer Movement, and then I started teaching at Pure Barre, and they were aware of it just because they were such an amazing company and they would like, let me like, use the space to, like, shoot videos and little things like that.

Jillian Curwin: Mmmhmm.

Sofia Blasco: And then I had brought it to their attention after I had trained as a teacher, I was like, I think this technique and this style of working out would be very easily adapted to people with disabilities. Ummm, and then eventually we kind of got the ball rolling and it took a while, but we got there and we had our first adaptive class which, they kind of just threw it to me and they were like, you, you're the person, make it up. Did not make it up. It's a very specific workout technique without much to make up.

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: But they were like, put the class together, let's see what happens. And it was amazing. And it's… The whole side of Pure Barre when you're, like, training as a teacher is that it is a technique and it's very technical and… But they train their teachers so well in the body and like, we have courses constantly where we're working on how to like, properly correct someone. So like, I didn't go in with any anatomy training and I've learned so much about the body as a Pure Barre teacher, and that's why I, I even brought it to them, because I was like it, to me, it's the same as a ballet class.

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: It's specific and technical based on the body, that in my brain, that is easily adapted to every body. And I was like, it's like the same thing I'm doing. Just, it's fitness, not ballet.

Jillian Curwin: Right. Can you…Before I have you go into a little bit more about like, the developing of the class, can you explain a little bit for those who may not be aware what exactly Pure Barre is?

Sofia Blasco: Yes, absolutely. I'm like, rehearsed for this. [laughter] Okay. So, Pure Barre is a high intensity but low impact workout. Just meaning that you always… Low impact means you always have one foot on the floor. So like, no jumping, it's very safe on your joints, but it's very intense for your muscles. So you'll work, like, the whole body in a workout class. It's really small movement, but you work your muscle to fatigue and then you stretch.

So like if you're doing a thigh series, you're in, you know, like a chair sit until your thighs are shaking, even though you've barely moved, you're shaking. And then you do a big stretch. So it's a full body workout. It's one of those things that like, if you walked in, you, most of the time it looks like nobody's even like, moving that much because it's such like, small little movements, but it's like the contracting of the muscles that basically brings them to fatigue to get stronger. And then there's always a stretch too.

Jillian Curwin: Yes. And having taken several classes, the shake is real. [laughter]

Sofia Blasco: Wild. People think we're kidding when we say that. And I'm like, no, your muscles like, physically like, earthquake shaking.

Jillian Curwin: Yes. And like I've seen it and it's like, oh! Because like, and again, we're doing very small moves, there's no jumping, which I love, and yet you're like, you're like looking down like, oh my gosh, I didn't think my muscles could shake this much…

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: Like, moving muscles I didn't know existed. Like, I didn't know I had these muscles to work.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah.

Jillian Curwin: So it is again, like you said, it's high intensity, but very low impact.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah, it's, it's crazy. And it's the only workout I've ever gotten into outside of dance. And I swear by it.

Jillian Curwin: I think so many dancers love it because again, it's like you're in the studio, you're at the barre, and again it's like, kind of like you're doing… You're up on your toes, you're doing pliés, which is just a small bend, so there's definitely, like, a dancer movement still in it…

Sofia Blasco: Yeah.

Jillian Curwin: Too. And it's like, again, it was a place that… I love taking barre classes, but for a long time I would take them if my cousins wanted to go. I would never go by myself because I struggled with the movements and my body. I'd be like, I don't have enough body to do this because, again, kind of reflect-...remembering what I was told in dance, and how I felt when taking dance classes is that I don't have enough length. I'm not, not just able to do these moves. And it was really when taking the class with you that really, like, got that spark back. And one, just seeing, again, like that, you were like, I'm teaching this adaptive class. Come. And I was like, I didn't think Pure Barre could be adapted.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: I truly…I am like, how do you adapt…? How do you adapt a barre class? I want to know. [laughter] So coming and doing that workout with you, and then continuing to go back, I was like, oh no like, I, I can do this. I don't need to… There are, again, ways to adapt it. And in each class I'm finding a new way to adapt a move, and we're… Either working with the instructor, just kind of saying, I want to see if this works and you can tell me if I'm wrong.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: Which I love that, again, about that class because it kind of again, you say like even though it is very technical and very precise, it does allow you to adapt.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah. And that's another thing that they train us so well is on teachers, is that to anybody, they're not talking specifically to the disabled community, but we're told as teachers, everything has a modification because it's meant to be a workout that's safe for your body. So like you said, naturally, even for non-disabled people, that's going to mean a lot of different things.

If you have an injury, or you're pregnant, or you had a surgery, or anything like that, there's going to be things in a Pure Barre class that you need specifically modified for you. So that's what really opened my eyes in training. I was like, it's like they're saying it's adaptive for people with disabilities. They're just not saying that…

Jillian Curwin: Yeah.

Sofia Blasco: Because they're not making that connection, but they're like saying the exact same thing. And I was like, oh my gosh, if we can adapt it for any injury, or any pregnancy, or anything that's needed, then it's super accessible naturally.

Jillian Curwin: Exactly.

Was there… Did you receive any kind of hesitation or any pushback when either developing The Dancer Movement or when developing these adaptive classes through Pure Barre?

Sofia Blasco: I did not. We've received just like so much good feedback from people. I would say the one kind of challenge as a business owner, in terms of Dancer Movement, and this is kind of going back to something you said earlier, is that because it doesn't exist like, I would reach out to people who were disabled, who were either in fitness or an art form around dance that didn't dance specifically, and it's almost like there was a lack of interest because they've gone their whole life thinking, oh, but I can't dance. And now all of a sudden they're 30 and I'm saying come take a dance class. And they're like, whoa, I didn't even think about ever doing that ever in my life. And they do try it and they love it. But I would say that was the only like, hesitancy we faced is that like, yeah, because it didn't exist people were almost like, oh, I just, you know, assume that after the age of five I was done dancing and they would never do it again.

Jillian Curwin: Right. I think, with making things more accessible and more inclusive, a challenge that I don't think is, is talked about necessarily like, is the fact that you're not just breaking the belief system of non-disabled people and thinking that this can't exist. You’re also breaking the belief system of disabled people who said this would never exist for me.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: And it's also like, getting them to trust that this is something that is safe for our bodies, and that we can do, and that it will be an environment that is accessible and inclusive because so much of the world around us isn't.

Sofia Blasco: Right. Yeah, it's it… that was a… And I've talked to other people. I'm in touch with a girl that has a gym, and she's not in New York, I think she's based in D.C., and she specifically has a gym for people with chronic illness, and just like talking to people in that realm and people like her, and it's all kind of something similar in that like, oh, people just didn’t…never thought it would exist.

So you really have to go the extra mile to yeah, one, like bring it to their attention. Two, kind of prove that you're actually making it accessible, because they feel so much people are told something's going to be accessible and then the world doesn't really know what that means and then it end up actually being accessible. Yeah. And then getting them in and being like, yeah, you can do this.

Jillian Curwin: Right. And then getting them to bring their friends.

Sofia Blasco: Right, exactly. [laughter] Referrals.

Jillian Curwin: Referrals are great.

I think, and again, like it's going back to the fitness industry as a whole and dance as a whole, is that disability for, you know, it's not just recently that it was, like, disability has not been welcome for a very, very long time.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah.

Jillian Curwin: And again, like you said, we're trying, we're making strides, both in dance and in fitness, but there is still a very long way to go.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah. Oh my gosh. It's a very, it's a very long road ahead.

Jillian Curwin: But I mean, I'm not stopping. I'm assuming you're not stopping.

Sofia Blasco: Not anytime soon!

Jillian Curwin: Good! Good. Because I get like… you, me…we need that. Like, you know, knowing that with the, what you're going to talk about and I'm going to let you promote, like, with the classes coming up soon like, I'm planning on inviting my friends who have different disabilities and inviting my friends who are not disabled to bring them in and say, hey, come check this class out, spread the word that this is happening, and getting people's attention.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah. It's…its, it's getting the people to come one time. Like you did. Just like you, you were like, how is this even…? How are you going to do this? And you are someone that's willing to give it a try without knowing, which is kind of scary. But yeah, getting people to come and, and exactly like you said, bringing non-disabled people too because that's just as important.

And I, I've actually taught dance master classes to groups of kids that are not disabled, and I've taught them like a disability class because you, you can't keep them separate.

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: Then that's like defeating the purpose. You know, if we can grow our young dancers to know that if they walk into a rehearsal space in 15 years, and they're choreographing a dance and someone is a wheelchair user, that shouldn't shock them. Or that's my hope. Maybe it will, but…

Jillian Curwin: Yeah.

Sofia Blasco: You know, it's just, oh, yeah, you're a dancer, too, and I'm going to work around this and I'm going to choreograph with you. But yeah, it's the same thing in fitness. Like, it's not… I don't want these classes to be separate forever. One day I want it to just be that anybody can walk into this class.

Jillian Curwin: Again you're ahead of the curve, because I feel like so often, when making things accessible and including disabled people, it's something separate. There's this belief that it has to be separate from what non-disabled people are doing, kind of, you know, like that separate…and I would say it's not even equal. I think it's still not even there yet.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: And so for you to say, I'm going to teach these students as if it was an adaptive class to show them, again, you are ahead of the curve on that because that, I think, needs to be the mentality in so many other industries, not just in fitness and dance, and that when making things accessible and inclusive and bringing disabled people into the conversation, it's not separate.

Sofia Blasco: Right. And it can't be.

Jillian Curwin: No.

Sofia Blasco: Like, okay, I, I wasn't a huge part of the disability community. I wasn't a huge ally until I started this company. And, even now I say to people like, I share all my own, like I share all The Dancer Movement Instagram and whatever posts on my own personal Instagram, not only to promote the business I own, but because most of my personal base is people that have nothing to do with the disability community, who mostly are dancers and in fitness.

Jillian Curwin: Right.

Sofia Blasco: And sometimes I almost I'm… I feel like I'm making more of a difference and impacting more when those people are seeing it, and clicking on it, and reading about it, and learning something about it then like…Obviously the, the people that are disabled and in that community, like obviously they want this. Obviously they know what's going on.

Jillian Curwin: Right. We know what we need. We know what's missing. We know what's lacking. It’s getting non-disabled people, it's getting allies to join in and speaking up to get the people who aren't aware or don't want to be made aware of what's going on, aware what's happening and what needs to be done and what needs to be changed. And I think it reflects, you know, after the class that you taught, that conversation that we had where it was very open, it was very honest, and like, I could tell that, you know, you and the other instructors who were there, you were listening. And it was so like just… it was refreshing to see.

Sometimes I feel like, you know, I'll see people are listening, but like, you can kind of tell that they're not really taking it in and wanting to actually act on what they're hearing. And… Like I could tell that you…not just you, the other instructors, like we're like, oh, there is something we can do here. I'm going to listen and I'm going to take what she's saying and what the other students are saying, and we're going to make some changes. It's not going to happen overnight.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: It’s not going to happen right away. But it started like… I could feel it in that room. Something shifted in a positive direction.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah, absolutely. And that was like…it, it was such… I'm so glad that we got to hang out after the class. Because yeah, it's one thing to like, have this class and you guys get to come and it was great and it was good for me to teach it and experience that. But yeah, I, I feel the same way that, like, there was more change. It, like, started to stir up and like, the Pure Barre community post class…

Jillian Curwin: Yes.

Sofia Blasco: When we were all just throwing ideas out there and oh, how does this work? And how do we make this accessible? And it's so helpful to have like, someone like you that, you know, disabled and in this fitness world, there and willing to walk someone like me, who's not disabled, through it. Because, you know, I…we can, we can listen and we can learn as much as we want. But, like, I'll never be in your shoes. You know, there's things I'm just not going to know unless I'm hearing it from you. And I think, especially in the fitness world, that's so important.

Jillian Curwin: Right. And likewise, like, I know what I need, I know what I want, but I don't necessarily know what's possible, which is why the dialogue, it goes both ways. That way, like, I want to talk to you and say this is what I need, and you to listen to those needs, and then to say, okay, this is what we can do…

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: And let's try. And maybe the first, you know, hundred ideas we have don't work, but that 101st idea might.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: So it goes both ways in that I know what I need, but also recognizing that what I need in the way I think I need it, isn't possible.

Sofia Blasco: Right.

Jillian Curwin: But there might be another solution. And there almost always is another solution.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah, I was just going to say the exact same thing. There's, there's always another solution. We just have to get there.

Jillian Curwin: Exactly.

So I gave a little bit of a teaser, but this will either come out the week before… the week of or the week before. But what is happening on October 2nd in New York City?

Sofia Blasco: Yes, October 2nd. Now I'm going to pull it up so I don't mess up my time and my place because I keep saying the wrong of Pure Barre studio, because there are so many.

So it's Sunday, October 2nd, and it's going to be at 2:00 PM [ET] at the Pure Barre in Flatiron, and it's going to be an adaptive and accessible Pure Barre class. So, as we said, all are welcome - disabled, non-disabled. I will be teaching it again. It will be a different class than the one you guys took before. So you’re welcome to come back a second time. And yeah, it's just going to be an awesome Pure Barre class that anyone can walk in and take, and feel safe taking. I'll be there beforehand. I'm happy to get emails if people feel like there are things they want to tell me before so I'm aware when I'm kind of planning the class. But as we said, Pure Barre's super adaptive kind of in the moment, and we're trained for that. So, and I'm sure there will be a hang out afterwards again so people chat.

Jillian Curwin: For sure. And I absolutely will be there and cannot wait. I'm so excited.

Sofia Blasco: It's going to be, it's going to be so fun. I’m so excited. The last one was, like, amazing. So I'm excited for this one.

Jillian Curwin: I also thought it was just so positive and so fun. Even though, again, we're like, muscles are shaking, we're wanting to like, make these 10 seconds or these ten moves- like reps go faster. It's like your body is like, what are you doing? But yeah…

Sofia Blasco: Even like me, because I'm not doing it, I'm teaching it.

Jillian Curwin: It even, it like… It's just like…this is fun. This is… I get high intensity, low impact, fun workout that can be made accessible. And I think that's just what we want overall. So here's a class, I will be there. I'm going to be telling my friends to be coming, if they can, try to get, again, as many people there. But yeah, I'm very excited.

Sofia Blasco: It's going to be amazing. I'll try to pick a really good playlist too.

Jillian Curwin: Yes.

Sofia Blasco: Because Pure Barre is very musically driven and it makes a world of a difference and you've got like a killer playlist, so I'm already thinking ahead.

Jillian Curwin: Remembering back, you had a pretty fire playlist the first time, so my expectations are quite high.

Sofia Blasco: They’re high now. Gosh.

Jillian Curwin: No pressure.

Sofia Blasco: No pressure.

Jillian Curwin: Who do you look up to? 

Sofia Blasco: I…My, my first reaction to this is always, and she won't care if I say her name, Julie, who is the woman with MS that inspired me to start the company. She is just…She's one of those people that says she's going to do something and it feels like two days later she's accomplished it and more. And yet, at the same time, she's always, always putting other people first. Every podcast she's ever been on, every situation she's ever been on, she's mentioning my name first, and what I do first. And she's just, she's accomplished so much and she's incredible.

Jillian Curwin: Love. Julie, if you're listening, come on the podcast.

Sofia Blasco: Oh my god, she would! She’s incredible and she has all the time. And she would, absolutely.

Jillian Curwin: Okay, we're going to make it happen.

Sofia Blasco: Yes.

Jillian Curwin: Are there any questions I have not asked that you would like to answer?

Sofia Blasco: Umm, I don't think so. That was, that was great. Yeah.

Jillian Curwin: Totally acceptable answer.

Where can people follow you and follow The Dancer Movement?

Sofia Blasco: So we post the most on our Instagram, which is just @thedancermovement. And from there we have a link in bio to all our other stuff. But if you do want to check out, like, our actual services and everything that's on our website, which is thedancermovement.com.

Jillian Curwin: And I will have links to all that in the show notes as well as links to the class on October 2nd. Again, if you're in NYC, you have nothing to do Saturday afternoon, disabled, non-disabled, I hope to see you there. I'm very excited. Cannot plug it enough.

Sofia Blasco: It's going to be amazing.

Jillian Curwin: I'm so excited.

So the final thing I do, it's like an icebreaker, but I do it at the end because it's more fun that way.

Sofia Blasco: Love it.

Jillian Curwin: So I have five categories and I just want to hear your favorite in each one.

Sofia Blasco: I love it.

Jillian Curwin: Okay, favorite book.

Sofia Blasco: The Magic Strings of Frankie Presto. I think that’s what it’s called. I read it so long ago.

Jillian Curwin: I do not know that one. What is it about?

Sofia Blasco: It’s a Mitch Albom book. I like, read it forever ago on the beach. It's like so random. But it's…He writes it like he's an old like, singer and guitar player, I think, like Elvis era. And he has like, these magical guitar strings. But he goes through and he meets all these famous singers from that era, and they're all real people, like that existed. And like Mitch, I think he actually went in and interviewed some of them, like about this fake person. And it's just… I'm a music nerd, so it's like, it's a music nerd…It's a, it's a great book.

Jillian Curwin: I'm adding that to my list of books to read.

Sofia Blasco: So random that that was my answer.

Jillian Curwin: Love it.

Favorite TV show.

Sofia Blasco: Seinfeld.

Jillian Curwin: You are the first person I think I've had on that said Seinfeld.

Sofia Blasco: Really?!

Jillian Curwin: It is such a good show.

Sofia Blasco: It's so, you know, I didn't watch it until very recently. Maybe it's my favorite right now because it's like fresh in my life.

Jillian Curwin: Yeah.

Sofia Blasco: But I mean, yeah, I've seen every episode now, but it's just…As a New Yorker, too, it's like, it feels like home every single… every single episode.

Jillian Curwin: Yes. Did you see Jerry Seinfeld's collaboration with Kith?

Sofia Blasco: I did not.

Jillian Curwin: I think it's with Kith. I'll…. I'll send you the…

Sofia Blasco: I was gonna say send me the thing.

Jillian Curwin: I'm pretty sure it’s with Kith. Some again can correct me if I’m wrong. I'll send you the pictures afterwards because it was amazing.

Sofia Blasco: Okay. Yeah, that's amazing.

Jillian Curwin: Favorite drink.

Sofia Blasco: Coffee.

Jillian Curwin: How do you drink your coffee?

Sofia Blasco: Black.

Jillian Curwin: Bold.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah.

Jillian Curwin: Favorite piece of advice you've ever given.

Sofia Blasco: Favorite piece of advice I've ever given? Just go for it. Don't hold back. Just go for it.

I had a dance teacher when I was in college, and she told us a story, and it was like about her going after her one dream dance company, which they tell you to do, but they're also like, have backups because you're probably not going to get in. And then what do you do? And she said to us, she said, “People always tell you not to put all your eggs in one basket.” But she said, “I think you should put all your eggs in one basket. Because if the basket breaks and your eggs fall, you can always scramble them.” And I was like, that is so silly. But I was like whoa! That's the best thing I've ever heard. So along those lines, go for it. Put all your eggs in one basket and see what happens.

Jillian Curwin: I love that. I think you might have answered my last one, which is favorite piece of advice you've ever received.

Sofia Blasco: That I would say…I would say that put all your eggs in one basket. You can always scramble ‘em.

Jillian Curwin: I love that. It's like a mindset ,I need to adopt because I never think of that. I was like, okay, I need to have, like, back-ups, and back-ups to my back-ups.

Sofia Blasco: Yeah.

Jillian Curwin: You know what? No.

Sofia Blasco: No. Who needs it? If you need it back-up, you'll come up with it when you need it.

Jillian Curwin: Exactly.

Sofia this has been such an amazing conversation. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you for teaching me about The Dancer Movement and adaptive fitness and adaptive dance. I'm so excited, again, for the class. October 2nd. I hope to see my New York friends there. They can… just thank you so much for coming on.

Sofia Blasco: Of course. Thank you so much for having me. This was great.

Jillian Curwin: Of course. You are welcome back anytime.

Sofia Blasco: Yes, with Julie. We're going to get her on.

Jillian Curwin: It's happening. Julie, if you're listening, it's, it's happening.

The final, final thing I just have to ask is for you, in your most fierce, badass voice possible, to remind my listeners that height is just a number, not a limit.

Sofia Blasco: Height is just a number, not a limit.

Jillian Curwin: Always Looking Up is hosted by Jillian Curwin and edited and produced by Ben Curwin. Please make sure to rate, review, and subscribe and follow on Spotify so that you never miss an episode. Follow me on Instagram, @jill_ilana, and the podcast, @alwayslookingup.podcast, for updates and check out my blog, jillianilana.com, for more content about what it is like to be a little person in an average-sized world.

Thanks for listening. See you next week.

Learn More:

Sign Up For The Adaptive and Accessible Pure Barre Class HERE

Follow Sofia:

Instagram: @sofiablasco97